It absolutely staggers me that there are people out here trying to find out a way to make capitalism work. There is no “one neat trick”. If you can accumulate wealth, then you accumulate power, and democracy under capitalism just puts the power of the state up for auction to the highest bidder.
Capitalism does not work. It can never work. It makes fascism inevitable. Capitalism needs to be completely left in the ashes of the past.
“we” don’t need it. Despite every large civilisation inventing it, small civilisation (150 person village) just doesn’t. And can thrive quite happily without it.
It’s when civilisation gets larger that we “need” money. You can’t build the LHC or Artemis 2 without some form of intermediary currency. The problem is, to do that you end up with the issues of power imbalances.
We will only get 150 people villages if civilizations collapses, billions die, and humanity turns to subsistence farming. Even among 150 people, there will be trade in goods and favors. People have different talents and skills.
As soon as trade develops between villages, currency becomes extremely useful. There are seasonal goods, especially in agriculture. Sheep are shorn in spring to produce wool, much earlier than harvest for Apples and grain. So if you want to exchange wool for Apples, you need to make a contract or IOU note to deliver Apples in a few months. Now you basically have vouchers for commodities. You can then trade the Apple voucher for new metal shears because you don’t actually want Apples. Suddenly you trade vouchers for vouchers and it becomes a little cumbersome. There’s also always the risk of a voucher not being honored. So the village council decides to issue standardized vouchers that can be redeemed for grain in the community granary. Currency is reinvented because It’s extremely useful.
Anarcho-Primitivism is certainly a romantic ideology.
There is one way how capitalism can work, and it did work for a while:
Worker action, from voting to unionisation, strikes up to revolution are all things that happen under the umbrella of capitalism, and as much as capitalists want to ban that, it’s all just part of the same coin.
If capitalists play nice and fair, pay good wages and make sure the workers have a decent live, then the system is stable and as a reward they get stability to make business.
If they get too greedy and squeeze the workers too hard, workers push back. They form unions, vote left, start striking, and in the worst case they destroy equipment and start a revolution. This is the kind of power that the people have.
In theory.
Due to clever manipulaton, the capitalists managed to divide the working class and pit them against each other. This worked fine for a few decades, but it’s wearing thin. It will take maybe 5-15 years until it all comes to a head and explodes.
And OP is right. Back in the day you had to get the military to shoot their own people. With automated weapon systems and AI/robots performing more and more of the productivity, this balance shifts rapidly, and it will likely lead to a total system breakdown with unforeseeable results.
Totally this. The capitalists feared that yet another country could spiral into revolution and then communism, so they had to keep the workers happy.
The collapse of the Soviet Union combined with neoliberalism and globalism shifted the balance. Now they could always threaten their workers “If you are unhappy, we’ll move production to Singapore or Vietnam. So behave if you want to have a job.”
With AI and robots this shifts further. Let’s see where this goes.
It’s not just moving industry to countries with cheap labor, there’s also importing cheap labor.
These two things have positive effects for workers elsewhere because they get skilled and comparatively well paid jobs.
A fully globalized economy should eventually balance itself out regarding wages for similarly skilled jobs.
With AI and robots this shifts further. Let’s see where this goes.
It will be fascinating to see a post scarcity economy. Will all people work as artists, personal trainers, motivational speakers, artisanal bakers, and such?
It absolutely staggers me that there are people out here trying to find out a way to make capitalism work. There is no “one neat trick”. If you can accumulate wealth, then you accumulate power, and democracy under capitalism just puts the power of the state up for auction to the highest bidder.
Capitalism does not work. It can never work. It makes fascism inevitable. Capitalism needs to be completely left in the ashes of the past.
Yeah, even the concept of money needs to be abandoned. We don’t need it.
If we don’t need it, why does practically every civilization invent it?
What’s your alternative? Barter?
“we” don’t need it. Despite every large civilisation inventing it, small civilisation (150 person village) just doesn’t. And can thrive quite happily without it.
It’s when civilisation gets larger that we “need” money. You can’t build the LHC or Artemis 2 without some form of intermediary currency. The problem is, to do that you end up with the issues of power imbalances.
We will only get 150 people villages if civilizations collapses, billions die, and humanity turns to subsistence farming. Even among 150 people, there will be trade in goods and favors. People have different talents and skills.
As soon as trade develops between villages, currency becomes extremely useful. There are seasonal goods, especially in agriculture. Sheep are shorn in spring to produce wool, much earlier than harvest for Apples and grain. So if you want to exchange wool for Apples, you need to make a contract or IOU note to deliver Apples in a few months. Now you basically have vouchers for commodities. You can then trade the Apple voucher for new metal shears because you don’t actually want Apples. Suddenly you trade vouchers for vouchers and it becomes a little cumbersome. There’s also always the risk of a voucher not being honored. So the village council decides to issue standardized vouchers that can be redeemed for grain in the community granary. Currency is reinvented because It’s extremely useful.
Anarcho-Primitivism is certainly a romantic ideology.
There is one way how capitalism can work, and it did work for a while:
Worker action, from voting to unionisation, strikes up to revolution are all things that happen under the umbrella of capitalism, and as much as capitalists want to ban that, it’s all just part of the same coin.
If capitalists play nice and fair, pay good wages and make sure the workers have a decent live, then the system is stable and as a reward they get stability to make business.
If they get too greedy and squeeze the workers too hard, workers push back. They form unions, vote left, start striking, and in the worst case they destroy equipment and start a revolution. This is the kind of power that the people have.
In theory.
Due to clever manipulaton, the capitalists managed to divide the working class and pit them against each other. This worked fine for a few decades, but it’s wearing thin. It will take maybe 5-15 years until it all comes to a head and explodes.
And OP is right. Back in the day you had to get the military to shoot their own people. With automated weapon systems and AI/robots performing more and more of the productivity, this balance shifts rapidly, and it will likely lead to a total system breakdown with unforeseeable results.
The Soviet Union as a counterweight was good for worker benefits as well. Keep the workers happy, keep the machine running.
Western Euro-Communism was seen as a real threat during the 1960s and 70s.
Totally this. The capitalists feared that yet another country could spiral into revolution and then communism, so they had to keep the workers happy.
The collapse of the Soviet Union combined with neoliberalism and globalism shifted the balance. Now they could always threaten their workers “If you are unhappy, we’ll move production to Singapore or Vietnam. So behave if you want to have a job.”
With AI and robots this shifts further. Let’s see where this goes.
It’s not just moving industry to countries with cheap labor, there’s also importing cheap labor.
These two things have positive effects for workers elsewhere because they get skilled and comparatively well paid jobs.
A fully globalized economy should eventually balance itself out regarding wages for similarly skilled jobs.
It will be fascinating to see a post scarcity economy. Will all people work as artists, personal trainers, motivational speakers, artisanal bakers, and such?